r/telemark • u/stellarwarfare • 20d ago
Telemark starter tips?
Hi! I've been alpine skiing all my life, but will be teaching someone how to ski for most of the season, and want something fun to reset my skill level as well. You good people seem like the right kind of folk I want to be in with.
I'm a big dude, wearing a mondo 30.5-31 usually for alpine, and I usually run 185-189cm skis.
It seems like used gear for my size doesn't really exist on FB marketplace or Ebay (maybe one listing for a mondo 31 / size 13 US on Ebay, for some exceedingly crunchy gear).
Would you all recommend just going to swaps / used stores to try and find stuff? If so, any favorites in the Denver / wider Colorado area?
Secondly, is it better to start off with shorter skis for learning tele? I've heard conflicting info on going shorter.
Any input would be appreciated, thanks!
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u/DinnerEmergency 20d ago
I would start shorter. I’m likely not as big as you, but well over 200, and I sized down when I started learning. I normally ski 185s on alpine skis and ski 177-180s on tele.
I also would recommend finding a used 75 mm set up on a pair of skis that aren’t overly wide (more all-mountain width than dedicated pow ski width). Something 85-95 mm in the width is a good sweet spot.
If you can’t find a good used boot and have to buy new, I’d recommend a Scarpa T2 Eco. I have really large calves and never had a problem with them. They have a heat-moldable Intuition liner that worked well for me, but they eventually get packed out and will need replacement to restore performance.
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u/Remarkable_Impact469 19d ago
I think you should go longer, and not shorter than your Alpine set. The cons of longer skis can mostly be overcome by skills and techniques, but the cons of shorter skis cannot.
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u/TDYfly 20d ago
Thanks for posting! These questions really catalyze the excitement for making turns with good people again.
Keeping an eye out for used gear is part of the fun but if you can find used but more recently designed and manufactured bindings you’ll help yourself out in several ways. Primarily, modern telemark bindings (e.g. 22designs Vice, AXL, Outlaw, anything from bishop or even the Voile switchback) will have enough lateral stiffness to let you make alpine turns when you need too. A lot of thrift shop finds will be mounted with Black diamond or G3 targa type bindings that trend toward the less active side (think floppy) that require more precise inputs from you.
This leads directly to ski length. With more active bindings you’ll be able to apply pressure more evenly along the length of a ski length you’re used to, again allowing for familiar alpine turns when you need them as you learn.
When I have tried shorter skis (like 176cm) in the past (normal set up is 182cm to 186cm) i was less likely to get the tails crossed up in the bumps but that was about the only advantage unless you really want a shorter turn radius.
Feel free to DM with follow ups. I’d be happy to help you by keeping an eye out for resale gear here in central Colorado. My preferred spot in Denver is Bent Gate Mountaineering in Golden.
Have a great season.
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u/Cambelmacd 20d ago
How big a difference in control do outlaws have over touring oriented bindings (meidjo, voile, etc)?
Im planning on outlaws but don’t love the weight
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u/Remarkable_Impact469 19d ago
Not much. I can say that I have at least 90% of edge control and lateral stability with my TTS transit compared to Outlaw. I'm not sure if binding weight itself does anything to skiing, either.
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u/Cambelmacd 19d ago
Thank you. So what’s the reason for BMF or outlaws? Durability? All things being equal, doesn’t everyone want a lighter binding?
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u/Remarkable_Impact469 19d ago
I've sold my Outlaw (doesn't like duckbutt) but still have my BMF/R. I'm not quite sure, actually. Comes this winter I'll compare the BMF, Transit and the new Simpll on carving skis on some east coast ice to see if they make a difference.
I would guess for a reasonable increase in performance as the weight goes up... But if it's not significant enough, then there's no good reason for me to bother with a heavy binding even though I'm at the resort 85% of the time.
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u/HistoricalMud6356 20d ago
Also, sorry, I bought the last pair of mondo 31.0 T1's on ebay last week.
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u/fundthmcalculus 19d ago
Telemark swap meet FB group. Scarpa T2 eco (comes in 31+) 179cm skis (like everyone says, size down a touch for tele). Softer is easier to learn, but it makes going fast much harder. I'm 6'4", and I rock 186s.
Welcome to the knee dropping gang!
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u/Remarkable_Impact469 19d ago
Doesn't everyone say to go long for tele? You really need a lot of platform for stability as you make that lunge in a carve. Going short is bearable, though.
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u/fundthmcalculus 19d ago
Shorter is easier IMO. Remember, you're converting 2 shorter skis into 1 longer ski.
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u/Remarkable_Impact469 19d ago
Shorter is certainly easier, but it puts a cap on your performance. You are also not converting both to one longer ski... that's not a correct mental picture. For example, your lead ski may do fine, but your trailing ski can suffer a tip dive, which shorter skis are more prone to. From time to time you will need to apply different techniques on either skis separately.
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u/Jack-Schitz 19d ago
Welcome!
I'm 6'5" 230-40 and am now in a Mondo 32s. I ride 108/190s as my CO daily driver, but I have been Tele skiing for decades. I learned on the East Coast on 80 something 191s and I don't think it really slowed me down. At 30.5-31 you are lucky as you fit in the new NTN boots. In 32s I am stuck in 75mm unfortunately and if my feet get any bigger, I am going to have to get frostbite or start trimming toes.
You can try going to swaps, but the low volume of Tele gear made, and your size is going to make it much more miss than hit. Having said that, I am either in someplace warm or up in the Vail valley so my ski swaps may be smaller than yours. All in all, though it's pretty rare that I come across someone my size on Tele gear on the hill. Long story made short, you might have to buy new and do so fast because large sizes sell out pretty quick.
As for tips, take a few lessons. You are going to have the tendency to do what is called a fake-e-mark turn which is basically an alpine turn with a lunge added to it on the end. I see this all the time with people on the mountain and you really need to have an instructor there to "beat" that out of you early on otherwise you are doing a lot of wasted reps and developing bad habits.
What is your home hill?
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u/JohnnyMacGoesSkiing 19d ago
Def go 1 size shorter, My Tele journey went from 1 size long, to the right size, to 1 size short. I definitely like 1 size short the most.
Short and fat is a hoot in the trees of New England. For me the ultimate backcountry tree ski is probably like 160cm by 100+mm, though I've skied even shorter and enjoyed it. I am 66" on a good day, for reference.
I know Denver is a long way from SteamBoat Springs, but there was a great shop out there that had a Tele Rental Fleet and sold used skis. Its been a while, things may have changed. https://backdoorsports.com/. It might be worth checking out.
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u/Skiata 19d ago
Good idea to pick up tele while teaching.
If you are shopping new/used boots, bring your alpine liners, they may work better than the existing ones.
If you have the chance, get twin tips so you can ski switch. It will keep you going slow for whom ever you are teaching, you will be awkward like them and you end up with an excellent tele-skill.
Don't spend a ton of $ on first skis. Don't ski in pain so boots are worth $. Bindings, suggest 75mm 22 designs gear. Vice/Axl/Hammer Head. Mount your own, preferably on an old pair of alpine skis you liked. Take a lesson.
Ask questions here.
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u/Outrageous_Oil_9435 18d ago
If you are just experimenting while teaching the littles, just go cheap. 75mm gear is somewhat abundant, allows you to kneel down all the way to help with getting the kids back in their bindings and if I’m being honest, allows you to feel where you may be slacking in the turn. If you find you enjoy it and want to preserve the turn, upgrade at that point. On ski length, I’m an old guy, 5’4” and about 145lbs. I ski a 177-183 depending on the manufacturer. I ski the same length in alpine (on the rare occasion that I lock ‘em’ down).
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u/designer_2021 19d ago
If you can find used boots or bindings on wrong size skis just use an old alpine pair you might already have then remount with the Tele setup.
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u/Recent-Atmosphere761 19d ago
I did the same as you (only 20 years ago) when teaching my kids to ski. I recommend getting an NTN setup and not going too short. If/When you get Teli turn down I have found that skiing on shorter skis I tend to cross my tip of the uphill trailing ski over the tail of the downhill ski or get it tangled up with my dh boot/binding.
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u/dytele 19d ago
Get Allen and Mike's Telemark tips book.