r/malaysia • u/JohanPertama • Aug 02 '26

Politics Guy wasn't wrong

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SS spoke about PH losing its principles back then. Has he been proven right?

809 Upvotes

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272

u/TallMongoosee Aug 02 '26

He has been proven right since PH started to ally with BN, being wishy washy with their 'refomasi' bs

172

u/Very_Type_C Aug 02 '26 edited Aug 02 '26

Malays pissed at PH for working with Bersonglap Nasional so they vote for Bersonglap Nasional in NS.

115

u/ctyx96 Aug 02 '26

Let me give an example, if you have a boss who treats you like shit, then suddenly a new manager came in and say that he will do what’s right and help you fight back, and you chose to believe in him only for him to suck up to the boss in the end. Would you hate the boss or the manager more? For many, it will be the latter. I’m not defending this thought, but this is the fact for many ex-PH voters.

58

u/Old_Camel_6745 Aug 02 '26

You're right..exactly my sentiment after the last GE. Vote new government in in hopes there will be changes.

In the end, same shit diff GE.

39

u/ctyx96 Aug 02 '26

Not just lack of changes, i’m so disappointed in the Azam Baki case and nepotism involving Nurul.

4

u/KieranRozells Aug 02 '26

On the flip side i'm curious to hear what the expectation actually was from PH.

They didn't have majority to form a govt. It was BN or nothing iirc.

So, it wasnt ideal, but the alternative was... PAS govt?

11

u/-protonsandneutrons- Aug 02 '26

Nail on the head. What's more dangerous? A clearly-labelled poison bottle or a water bottle hiding poison?

This is often perception more than reality, but that has been true in the history of elections in the history of the world.

Sadly, there seems to be very few in PH that are willing to accept that they now appear as that poison in the watter bottle.

3

u/Lumpy_Aardvark_6485 Aug 05 '26

Agree. Was expecting more changes and more progress. Definitely more pissed. I can understand why voters change their vote. But your analogy makes me realised something. The reason the manager cannnot make progress bec he is not the true boss. Alot of power, riches, industry ownership, influence are still with the boss.

1

u/ctyx96 Aug 05 '26

Yep this is a good point. This is the reason i did not bring up PH not locking up the corrupted BN members, because frankly speaking i somewhat understand they need to satisfy BN to keep them in the coalition. I only brought up the Azam Baki and Nurul case because this is all PH, no one else to blame.

1

u/abdulsamri89 Aug 02 '26

This is what PH supporters here lack of understanding

23

u/ctyx96 Aug 02 '26

Because honestly what other choices are there? BN with open-day corruption, PH with hypocrites, PAS with religion-oriented ruling. It’s bleak.

0

u/Anxious-Net-9016 Aug 02 '26

Huhu, but I cant quit now .No other companies(country) is offering me a new job

8

u/qianli2002 Aug 02 '26

If both sides are bad, what's wrong with voting the other side? Pretty insane for PH supporters to blame their party's inability to attract voters on the voters themselves.

36

u/-protonsandneutrons- Aug 02 '26

I would love voters to reject BN, but hasn't PH been basically whitewashing BN for the past three years? We all knew this: if PH saves BN, BN will never return the favour to PH. The only damaging scandal against BN had been its kleptocracy and 1MDB.

But the "top strategists" at PH had spent years trying to pretend BN corruption isn't a problem. Per PH:

To a less politically literate ordinary voter, Madani Gomen, and especially PH, has fully cuci tangan BN:

They think now, "BN tiada skandal. BN tiada rasuah. BN tak tipu. BN tak jahat. BN bukan pencuri. Semua pemimpin BN, baik sahaja. Zahid pun jadi Timbalan Perdana Menteri. Itu di bawah PH lah. Jadi Zahid pun bersih."

If PH politicians stop BN cases, low-information voters think BN is clean. That is how elections are won / lost: not on rational thinking, but on propaganda, optics, perceptions, sentiment.

Today PH and BN both agree that BN is basically rasuah-free. If you are not politically literate, you begin to assume PH are telling the truth and BN are telling the truth.

5

u/RaY_OF_HoP3 Aug 02 '26

Genuinely asking, what do you think PH should have done when it came to forming the government back then?

A. Form the coalition with BN to secure a stable government, even if it meant compromising on many of its promised reforms.

B. Refuse to work with BN, stay in the opposition, and preserve its reform agenda and political identity, even if that meant giving BN/PN the chance to form the government instead.

Because imo, regardless of what they chose, they would have lost either way, just that A gave the country the short-term relief via stability it required. Though of course, B would have been a better option for their long term political survival.

16

u/-protonsandneutrons- Aug 02 '26 edited Aug 02 '26

This has been asked and answered a dozen times in r/malaysia. But if you are genuinely curious and legitimately don't know,

This black-and-white is a false dichotomy. It is Anwar's ultimate, lasting arrogance: "I had no choice." PH had other choices and it’s odd you haven’t spent time thinking about them.

  1. PH controls key Ministries: Finance, Economy, Education, Health, Communications, Youth & Sports, Agriculture, Housing, Transport, Home Affairs, Digital, Human Resources, etc. Very, very few have seen competent, genuine, or serious reforms in these Ministries. Fadhlina covers up school abuse cases and focused on flag pins lmao. Dzul wants more privatised healthcare. Fahmi is hellbent on media censorship. Saifuddin protects corrupt police. Etc. 

  2. Anwar had unilateral powers to enact temporary key reforms as Prime Minister. MACC Chief nomination, Chief Justice nomination, JAC nominations (Idrus Harun, Terrirudin Salleh), Election Commissioners, Police Force, all PKR Ministers, all DAP Ministers, all AMANAH Ministers, all WARISAN Ministers, etc. All of that was controlled by Anwar and Anwar alone. Did Anwar do that? 

  3. In Parliament, many major reforms only required a 50% + 1 majority. Too many are obsessed with 2/3, but those should've been the capstone, not the first ones. PH + Borneo is already a majority. But still, even without a majority, show that the reforms are being attempted, even if you lose some. UMNO can pretend to be its “check and balance” role against DAP; DAP shows that it is doing everything possible; Anwar says laws are under Parliament, not him; etc.

  4. Yet not hardly one has been meaningfully attempted by PH. See MACC Act, JAC Act, OSA, Peaceful Assembly Act, CMA, Sedition Act. Even seat boundary redelineation only requires 50% +1, not a 2/3 majority.

  5. Anwar doesn’t need every reform to actually succeed to gain popularity. He merely needs to show PH is making sincere attempts: elections are frequently won / lost on optics & perceptions, not always results. 

  6. Most simply, Anwar could’ve been far more transparent: “To maintain my position as Prime Minister, I must request the AG to withdraw most UMNO-related charges. I believe PAS is a bigger danger than corruption. We also need a former UMNO Minister as Chief Justice. Here are the 50 problems with PAS…” 

PH did nothing ^^ of the sort. Anwar especially does not want to be honest with voters because Anwar genuinely likes working with UMNO & doesn't think reforms are critical; MACC doesn’t hurt Anwar. SOSMA doesn’t hurt Anwar. Anwar literally asked for judicial immunity as Prime Minister lmao.

So he’d much rather lie, lie, and lie (”no compromise on corruption! Madani is equally fair to all races! The judiciary is giving DNAAs, not Madani!”) because he knows the truth is far, far too shameful and unpopular.

Do you think PH would've gotten even 50% of its GE15 seats had Anwar loudly and publicly admitted that, "Even if PH doesn't get a majority, I will align with BN and ensure a stable government of PH + BN. That will require me to stop most UMNO cases, install an UMNO Chief Justice, appoint Azam Baki 3x, enable massive media censorship, coverup corruption cases, interfere in the judiciary, and try to claim legal immunity."

//

Would even attempted reforms have made Anwar & PH uncomfortable? Sure! But, PH was never elected to “stay comfortable” and “take it easy”. Reforming since Day One was meant to be incredibly grueling, painful, and difficult: PH just aligned with its arch-nemesis (at least publicly). How did PH think that will go?

This is elementary and it's a little tiring many are obsessed with Anwar's "stability [but only for corrupt politicians] is the most important thing ever in the history of the country". That is not how voters think and I'm tired of people pretending they don't already know that.

26

u/karlkry Aug 02 '26

nah. Malays that pissed at PH for working with BN just dont come out to vote. all there is there to it.

17

u/aberrant80 Aug 02 '26

Which in effect, is a vote for BN.

10

u/karlkry Aug 02 '26

exactly.

in the end of the day voting poll will count the number of people who dont vote and put the numbers under BN.

4

u/SlowpokeExplorer Aug 02 '26

Ahhh yes. The fearmongering tactics.

"We don't need to do better. We just need to fearmonger the people." - PH in elections, probably

-4

u/Buttdehole Aug 02 '26

I don't realize that is how Malaysia's election works. Someone need to change that. No way the SPR can determine that if I don't vote, my vote count as for BN. No wonder they won/s

2

u/Sam_Shelby Aug 02 '26

I don't think only Malay pissed at PH. Sabah election just prove that

9

u/SilentGamer95 Aug 02 '26

Common sense isn't so common anymore

8

u/PuzzleheadedNail7 Aug 02 '26

I've said this before, cut out the middleman and buy direct from the factory. Makes sense doesn't it?

3

u/Chry0n Aug 02 '26

What does this proposal even mean? Reform voting so we pick Prime Minister by popular vote or what? Or reform voting so we have more independent candidates rather than the tripartisan system we have? Your idea so vague

3

u/PuzzleheadedNail7 Aug 02 '26

I'm not proposing anything. I'm saying over the last two years many voters get the feeling Madani is a bad copy of BN. And many feel the copy is unnecessary, as evidenced by the state elections in Johor and Negeri Sembilan.

9

u/tlst9999 Aug 02 '26

It's the thing that if you promise change, and you join the existing establishment after winning the election,

You promise a better shop, but when the rubber hits the road, you join the existing shop. Then, the question arises. You give the same service. You give the same answers. Why should the voters vote for you?

7

u/aberrant80 Aug 02 '26

So the idea is that at first you wanted change, but when you didn't get the change you wanted, you now prefer to go back to the thing you wanted to change from?

9

u/tlst9999 Aug 02 '26 edited Aug 02 '26

The idea is at first I wanted change, and I didn't get the change I wanted, and I didn't settle with "They promise. They didn't do. Let them do what they want."

If a party gets voted in and they know they don't have to fulfill their promises and will still get votes, what's the point of an election? That's not a good reality at all.

We vote against them because we want better for our country, and we still give a damn about higher standards for the country's government, even if it means taking a step back and voting again for BN. Because the next round, we hope PH will take the voters and their promises more seriously.

0

u/abdulsamri89 Aug 02 '26

Punish the people that don't deliver or you rather people vote in PAS ,since BN failed.. PH failed we should apoint for PAS after this right?/s

Like I said just admit your mistake PH and move on , prepared your self to become opposition back, be a good opposition and the rakyat will vote you back

0

u/abdulsamri89 Aug 02 '26

So you want Malays to vote for PAS instead? At least BN could control PAS but voting for PH/PKR they can't control DAP

In term of lesser evil that PH supporters keep talking about , I'm pretty sure BN is more lesser evil to PAS am I right?

5

u/willp0wer Aug 02 '26

they can't control DAP

You're delusional. You don't know what the Chinese are saying about DAP now, you only listen to what sensational crap PN/PAS politikus are shouting

7

u/lin00b Aug 02 '26

Wait what? PKR cant control DAP? The same DAP thats keeping such a low profile that people are comparing them to MCA?

The jury is still out if BN can control PAS, PKR/DAP failed, bersatu failed.. and after each round PAS became stronger

0

u/UndeadLovecraft Aug 02 '26

So what… are they going to be voting for PN then? Isnt that the worse choice since PAS ministers are incompetent