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u/sunkencore Jun 10 '22
You didn’t meet anyone you liked? Why no positive characterisations at all?
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u/BhupeshV Jun 10 '22
Out of 100 discussions happening on this sub 98 belongs to compensation/notice period/ X better than Y. It's becoming a hiring forum. Rarely anyone asks a well defined dev challenge in here.
Hey OP, sub mod here
Sub posts reflect what the new gen folks care about nowadays, I agree with on you on some part, most people folks care about jobs because that's how our society is settled in right now. People who are at senior levels don't necessarily engage in meaningful discussion online, If you think this should change, then create discussions you want to see in the community.
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u/theRishu Jun 10 '22 edited Jun 10 '22
We are gen Z. We dont care about your shits.
If people can get better paying job while at time before they join your company it means you pay less. Stop faking dude.
Bet you cant even share salary structure of your company.
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u/Conscious_fridge Jun 10 '22
Random question are you hiring fresher for an intern 🗿
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u/raddiwala Jun 10 '22
I’d like to know more about your hiring process.
You get Leetcode chads because in interviews its all DP and Graph questions. How else is one supposed to solve them?
Do you provide feedback to candidates when you reject them? Decline them decently?
Do you respond to all the applicants?
The existing practices are shitty yes but if you’ve identified them I’d like to really know how you’ve thought about solving them.
If you are in it for money
What the fuck else would I be in for. I’ve got myself to feed and people to take care for. This is my work not my life. If someone is willing to pay me more I will go. Money is important. I dont have the privilege to work for pleasure or my passion. Passion doesn’t feed me.
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u/WonderfulPlay Jun 10 '22
I’m sorry that nobody is joining your shitty startup. Pls cry somewhere else.
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u/raddiwala Jun 10 '22
Workplace shamers
If I’m dissatisfied with something I’m not allowed to leave? What kind of asnine logic is this?
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u/beingsmo Jun 10 '22
Workplace shamers?
Some workplaces deserves to be named and shamed and by the looks of it , your startup is one such place too.
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u/asking_for_a_friend0 Jun 10 '22
I dunno but there needs to be "A Tale of Indian HR" too. If we have a shitty dev attitude problem that's because how devs are prepared to fit in this shitty market.
You're coming from a decently funded startup, with its reputation at risk, so you do hire with MNC standards. But outside of your space, India is full of shitty HR practices and abuse beyond your imagination.
The behaviour you mentioned in your post is a DIRECT result of what the market demands and how abusively it treats devs; driving them desperate driving them nuts.
And I absolutely disagree with your "complain" point, I am so sorry but its typical of Indian execs/hr/senior to not take any sort of complaint at all and shrug off all criticism with aggressive retaliation. Can't agree with that point in a lifetime. That's culture getting to you, sorry again.
I do appreciate you post but I also thing this sub is a blessing to discuss dev issues and I disagree about "hiring forum" part too. Where should they go, Quora or what?
Again, I emphasize what you are saying is not wrong and I am not questioning your claims but its much more than what you are seeing and that's because you're working at a fine ass company. Try a shitty small scale tech company or worse start up in India, see what execs demand from innocent.
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u/daveSavesAgain Jun 10 '22
I am pretty sure job descriptions at OP’s company has 12 - 14 technologies, and if a candidate asks why, this top tier shite will call them arrogant.
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u/safafaf122_throwaqy Jun 10 '22
Love how this CTO is humblebragging , while also putting down all other devs cuz they do not fit his idea of perfect slave labor.
Bhai IIT karke python seekh ke apne ko T-90 tank mat samjho , aadha story code karoge complexity wala to tum bhi din bhar stackoverflow ka gannd hi chaatoge ~ Someone please translate, not good in english
obligatory , get off your high horse.
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u/the_itchy_beard Jun 10 '22
office is not letting me come at 12 pm
I just now attended my friends wedding function and came home. It is 2:30 PM, now I am going to login to work.
If there is no flexibility in timings, the stupid company can fuck off. This is 2022. We are not slaves to corporations.
compensation/notice period/ X better than Y
Yes we work for money. Why the hell do you think the employee cares about your company's success? Is he the one becoming a billionaire if the company succeeds?
If you don't like us, you can go hire Americans. Oh wait!! they are even more demanding, and will ask you to fuck off right on your face.
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u/Random_human888 Jun 10 '22
What an energy boost on friday🤪Nothing more peaceful than seeing a tier 1 college Series A funded startup seeeteeeooo ranting🕊☮️
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u/asking_for_a_friend0 Jun 10 '22
Trust is a two street. Funny thing about founders is they will take out time from their schedule to write a thread about what all is wrong about world or people in general but will put a lot of organisational issues by same people under the rug.
LMFAO. Is that you? Preach (?)
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u/DateOk4963 Jun 10 '22
Oh please. What a privileged high-horsing cunt.
Have the balls to mention your company. We’ll tell you what’s wrong with your company.
Shove that tier-1 tag up your arse
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u/Amazing_Theory622 Jun 10 '22
Op was expecting accolades and bravado....got reality check from other side instead
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u/gimme_pineapple Jun 10 '22
I agree with a lot of what you're saying and I think junior devs should read this to better understand the other side, but here are my thoughts:
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This subreddit is specific to India, so you have to understand that the geographical context will cause the discussions to be focused around Indian job. If I wanted to discuss dev challenges/problems, why would I post it on an India-specific forum instead of some other region-agnostic forum where I could get responses from across the world?
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The attitude problem with junior devs is real. In fact, I would say I had an attitude problem too when I was younger. The best solution IMO is having a humble and friendly senior team. When I saw the way the senior devs behaved despite being extremely talented, I corrected myself.
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When you are hiring someone, why not assume that the other party is in it for the money?
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Why do you have a problem with workplace shaming? The average employee in India is treated very poorly, because the employers hold all the leverage. Software devs are among the first employees who have some leverage and they use it to get the best deal for themselves. In your own words, "World is hard, learn the ways to deal with it". Companies are allowing the devs to work at their own times and provide them with loads of benefits. They are not doing it out of the goodness of their heart. They want to attract high-quality developers. If you want them for your own company, you need to step up. Listen to the people.
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It is mind-boggling that you think a 90 day notice period is justified. It is just a manipulative tactic used by companies to make it harder for their employees to switch. Signing a contract does not make it okay, and the employee is totally justified in complaining. Write it off as a first-world problem if you want, but know that you will loose talent because high-quality devs know that they have better options.
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You mentioned that your hiring team is frustrated with the the unethical behaviour of the engineers. This goes both ways. Understand that your company is a part of an industry, and the companies in the industry are as guilty of unethical behaviour as the employees are. For example, I think a 90 day notice period is unethical. In such an environment, an employee who chooses to remain ethical will do so at his own detriment. With that said, I do think that there is a balance here, and both sides should endeavour to do much better.
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The name-calling you decided to use in this thread is just weird (The arrogant MF, Pseudo Alphas, etc.). It has a strong implication that you are better than everyone else. It comes across as very snobby, especially since you decided to post it in a forum of software engineers.
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u/1StraightFact Jun 10 '22 edited Jun 10 '22
I agree with you on some interviewing parts like a, b and c, specially DSA punks who mindlessly do DSA all day and rotting them down like a textbook. They are not flexible and situation adaptation skills.
Now comes to disagreeing part, I think you need some reality check on that.
People don't become unethical, their companies make them. They join as a naive fresher and then realize the company have their way with them. They will naturally become more aware and take decisions that is better for them.
As you said, you will only find this awareness in junior and mid level people as they have realized that their own benefit is more important than company's. Unlike old people who will not say their mind instead of showing some spine. These spineless old boomers are the ones who find juniors whiny but in reality they are the one who are standing for workplace rights. Old people who will happily bend over just so they won't get scold by their boss is the main reason this industry has become more toxic.
Next 90 days notice is bad, even if you read contracts many people don't know that its a trap and some might've had some financial situation. Getting out of it is not a bad reason. Then there are cases where they were straight up lied to that 90 days NP is not bad or they can buyout by the very companies. Why wouldn't they have trust issues moving forward.
Guys telling you their flexible hours and need a canteen are also legit reasons. Every person has their requirements and reasons to switch.
Companies demand lots of things as principal demands from school kids and get ego hurt when called out. So what? going to threaten him big company against single employee just because they spoke their mind? There are many useless founders who give gyan all day on linkedin but can't take workplace criticism.
They cannot tell the money is the reason without HR living in 90s getting offended and doing emotional torture.
Do you mail every candidate about rejections? If not why expect others to show any courtesy to you? Ghosting is done by both.
In short: Employees don't act like this because they enjoy it, they need to because of trust issues they have developed(for right reasons) and company acting like entitled brats. The industry and previous employers are the reasons employees have generated this trust no one attitude. As an employee, you bend ones, you will be made to do so on daily basis, so better to be always satarkh.
(I'm typing on the phone, so there could be typos.)