Only respond if you know who fang yuan is.

This is a Bakker subreddit lol so I already know people are going to harp on this. But I’m curious who yall feel truly is better written?

I personally like Kellhus more. But I want to see someone actually debate fang yuan being higher quality somehow

Someone tell my I’m not imagining this amazing blooper.

I am a practicing psychiatrist specializing in the treatment of PTSD and a fledgling lover of SA/AE series. One of the things I find interesting about the series is how Seswatha’s dreams can be read through the lens of PTSD and the intergenerational transmission of trauma.

Seswatha’s dreams aren't only historical memories being passed down. They are recurring, emotionally laden experiences that intrude into the consciousness of later Mandati. The past doesn't stay safely in the past. It becomes something that the Mandate schoolman must experience, learn to embody, and survive.

There's a parallel with what I see in clinical practice and in the literature on trauma. Trauma can shape subsequent generations through attachment patterns, emotional regulation and learned responses to danger. Descendants may come to inhabit a psychological world ordered by events they never personally experienced. They don't literally inherit their ancestors' memories, but they may inherit the fear, vigilance, shame, and assumptions about reality that those experiences produced.

Seswatha's dreams concretize this process in a disturbing way. The historical trauma isn't merely transmitted through stories or behavior. It enters the consciousness of another person, disrupting the boundary between past and present, self and other.

Achamian often slips into the first-person narration of Seswatha. When describing Celmomas's death to Kellhus, he says: “He died in my arms, Kellhus. He was my most hated, most cherished friend and he died in my arms!” He immediately corrects himself: “I m-mean, I mean in S-Seswatha’s arms …” Achamian doesn't merely remember Seswatha's experience; he speaks from inside it, as though the boundary between the original trauma and its inheritor has dissolved.

The analogy has limits. Seswatha's dreams are a supernatural event: transmissions of memories, whereas intergenerational trauma in humans involves complex psychological, social, and biological mechanisms. But I think Bakker's treatment of memory makes something about trauma unusually visible: the way an experience can end long before its psychological life is over.

I'm curious whether other readers have interpreted the dreams this way...Also thinking about doing a post on clinical dementia and the Nonmen.

maybe creating the no god will ai will be good actually. you dont know. maybe it will be awesome

Can someone explain to me why anagog is the weakest spell? It shouldn't be inferior to gnosis in power, after all, there are thousands of anologies in our world, so why does everyone only use the dragon? As a humanities scholar and a person with a rich imagination, I simply cannot understand why sorcerers have such a weak imagination. I can think of hundreds of combat analogies that are not inferior to the dragon, or even superior. It seems to me that the Author specifically singles out this school so that gnosis looks much more attractive

One thing that shocked me was how people would say his writing can get philosophical and his pose is hard to understand which to my current read though I am not finding tbh , I find his writing straight forward, no constant and when POV was changing it was clearly done , not constantly head hopping which irritated me with Malazan.

When people were talking about grim dark I thought more in aspect as torture porn but I’m beginning to understand grim dark also refers towards how the character are so selfish in this book , do they really care about each other or are they trying to find and use anyone for their best survival option / task completion In a world where you have to have guard up constantly.

God knows what went over my head but on my reread I hope to pick up points I’ve missed

Heramari Iyokus - sorcerer, spy, drug addict. One of my favorite side characters. I love the deadpan way he communicates with beings as powerful as the Ciphrang. And I love how Bakker writes their perspectives. They’re not just pissed at being shackled but in incredible pain being in the dimension that Earwa resides. It’s all bright light and sharp angles.

This is picture I took at the West Fargo Public Library, where I first found The Darkness That Comes Before and got into this series a few years ago.

Now, shockingly, when I stopped by the library the other day, the other two books of PoN were on the shelf. I know for a fact that my library only had TDTCB when I first got into the series, because I looked it up; the larger Fargo public library only had a falling-apart copy of The Warrior-Prophet.

This is the first time I have personally seen signs the series is getting more popular!

I had to check because it is insane to me that Kevin Orton randomly decides to change the pronunciation of charecters that HE has already pronounced properly.

Hello, just passing through with a small question. I've read up on the book, and I wish to ask if anyone else shares the same thoughts on the matter. This will read like a psuedo-fanatic rough draft essay. Sorry. I like to catch attention sometimes.

The question itself is, "Is Sorcery simply Applied Metaphysics Engineering?"

Keep in mind, a lot of this is "I feel". So, like any insecure person, being the one that I am, I suppose I seek validation, but I am open to alternative thought!!! But WARNING, I babble.

-

''𝙈𝙖𝙜𝙞𝙘𝙠 𝙞𝙨 𝙩𝙝𝙚 𝙎𝙘𝙞𝙚𝙣𝙘𝙚 𝙖𝙣𝙙 𝘼𝙧𝙩 𝙤𝙛 𝙘𝙖𝙪𝙨𝙞𝙣𝙜 𝘾𝙝𝙖𝙣𝙜𝙚 𝙩𝙤 𝙤𝙘𝙘𝙪𝙧 𝙞𝙣 𝙘𝙤𝙣𝙛𝙤𝙧𝙢𝙞𝙩𝙮 𝙬𝙞𝙩𝙝 𝙒𝙞𝙡𝙡." - 𝘼𝙡𝙚𝙞𝙨𝙩𝙚𝙧 𝘾𝙧𝙤𝙬𝙡𝙚𝙮

-

Now, I shall preface \ that I have not finished the novels, however, my wanton imagination and desires for quick answers gesticulates my question towards the open air- that being the forum of this subreddit. Is sorcery indeed infinite in its applications?

This is all balderdash, but I theorize the Onta isn't concrete, in the sense of how one senses it. The world seems to operate on a pluralism-esque philosophy, where one's way of life is drastically altered depending on their paradigm. We can note that in the real world, one may experience the Material world and derive a philosophy based either on the vectors that push and pull us- or delve into idealism.

A Psûkhe may be spared from the bruising, because they are perhaps blind to their sin, their passion imunizes them from this. But could power be within just the belief itself? It’s the belief itself power, in that how once if they can perceive the Onta, it is a matter of molding that belief by using a set of pre-determined “factual paradigms”, (like how we can all collectively use the Pythagorean theorem, produce an agreed upon principle of the world).

I’m going to leave it there, but I’d like to engage in dialogue!

Sources & Links of why I think like this:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humorism

https://www.reddit.com/r/bakker/comments/jprtyn/comment/gbiinkg/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button

https://www.second-apocalypse.com/index.php?topic=2118.0

https://www.second-apocalypse.com/index.php?topic=2173.0

Hi everyone!

I’m considering ordering the Overlook Press paperback editions of The Prince of Nothing (THEY’RE SO PRETTY), but I’ve noticed some inconsistencies in the listed dimensions. The first two books are listed as 162 mm wide, while the third is listed as 137 mm wide.

The ISBNs are; 9781590201183 (The Darkness That Comes Before), 9781590201190 (The Warrior Prophet), 9781590201206 (The Thousandfold Thought).

Does anyone happen to own these editions and know whether they’re actually the same size?

Thanks in advance!

(I am undiagnosed)

Currently 260+ pages into TUC.
Truly, is this not the Slog of Slogs?
(Besides, would not weeping be redundant?)

Some great details that I found and thought I’d share, mild spoilers.

The Holca are a Thunyeri Clan whose lands run abreast of the Mop: the gnarled and dense Hell-forest that is home to countless Sranc and even Bashrag.
Thunyeri in general don black armor, take shrunken Sranc heads as trophies, and adopt a “barbarian” fighting style.
The Holca? Even more so.

Fun facts about the Holca:
-they possess two hearts.
-their hair is a fiery red, and their skin will actually turn red in the ferocious throes of battle.
-they consider Bashrag in particular to be their arch-foe. Imagine that. A warrior honed and sharpened for dueling Bashrag.
-Coithus Saubon’s Spearbearer, Bogyar the Holca Captain, narrowly saved Saubon’s life from a Bashrag surprise assault.
-Waigwa (pictured) took down one of the mightiest Bashrag warriors to be fielded by the Consult.

All this inspired the art: my attempt to capture this particular badass. (Glad he’s on our side?
And yes those are sranc heads on his helm, mocking Bashrag perhaps? Speaking of the helm, I don’t love it. I wanted to give it some kind of horns then changed my mind to wings astride the Circumfix. Just go with it.)

EDIT: Thanks for all the responses, the tone was overall way more positive than I thought it would be. I’ll give it a shot, you guys rock!

Hey fellow sloggers, I just thought I would take a quick survey from the Bakker hive mind about Tad Williams.

I love Bakker, GRRM, Tolkien, Sapowski, Howard. The first three black company books hit for me and I have been enjoying Lieber.

I read all of Malazan and it was ok but I don’t see myself going back. I liked Robert Jordan back in my teens/ early twenties but I probably won’t revisit. I read the main 9 Abercrombie books and they had some good parts but the plotting was terrible (the heroes was awesome though).

Anyways, I have been sampling a bunch of other recommended fantasy and decided the genre may not actually be for me, I have just been lucky in some of what I read.

tad williams is one of the last ones that I haven’t tried and I am curious what you folks of discriminating taste think?

I am not expecting the Second Apocalypse but curious if its worth the time commitment since I have heard it’s a slow burner.

thanks for any thoughts

I looked and couldn't find one online so I made one. I just read the chapter and feel it's pretty accurate, but correct me if I missed something and sorry about my handwriting and spelling.

1. Initial disposition

2. Inrtithi infantry + Conriyan cavalry break Shigeki phalanx but begin losing their formation. Fanim left gradually falls back using Anwurat as a hinge. Fanayl and the best of the cavalry attack the Anoni flank, the Anoni knights charge and are initially successful, but are then enveloped and routed, some dismount and form squares along with the infantry.

3. The Fanim hit the Anoni infantry in the flank and rout many, (but not the elite Kishati), they then surround the inrithi who hunker down in disorganized squares with the exception of the Nansur who hunker down in organized squares ;) , and pour arrows on them from all directions. The Fanim under Cinganjahoi attack the camp, but stumble upon the Scarlet spires. The khirgwi attack the Inrithi and pin Proyas down in a village. They also attack the banner but Kelhus keeps it up (just as fake kelhus is at the moment with serwe haha).

4. The fanim leave the camp, but are pursued by Athgiere and other reserve cavalry. Conphas leads a counterattack against the fanim surrounding the inrithi left and break them as well. Reserve cavalry (thunyeri or tydoni i think?) relieve Kelhus and the Kirghwi flee. Fanim everywhere retreat.

Lesson is that not routing is good, reserve cavalry is always good, and don't attack a camp full of sorcerers if they are planning to otherwise sit the battle out.

Is there anywhere on the internet that has an overview/walkthrough of the second set of books?

Holy shit. I don’t know what I expected and I was still surprised with every page.

Hes very very bad at hiding how much he actually likes Proyas its honestly so funny to read.