r/TWGOK • • Sep 09 '26

[Manga Spoilers] Ranting about the ending Spoiler

I figured the reason I have problems with the ending are chapters where Keima and Kaori talks about their ideas of happiness and where Keima talks about how he is going to walk on like everybody else.
As we know - Keima basically demolishes harem by choosing Chihiro. But he told Kaori that he wants to make everybody happy , and he needs to get to that ending. He couldn't have meant saving everyone from Satyr since he would do that even if he followed Kaori's logic. I mean, what he would gain by not doing it? Satyr wouldn't make him happy. And he couldn't have meant making every hostess happy - because otherwise he wouldn't try to destroy harem. So considering the ending his idea of making everyone happy doesn't make sense (maybe he wanted to make amends in the future somehow with the girls, but that would make Chihiro mad, so this is counterproductive).
About "walking like everybody else instead of throwing it all away" - what did that mean? I guess he either wanted to commit suicide, but this interpretation is not very probable. He wanted to stay alone without choosing any girl? What the problem with that? If he loved Chihiro anyway - it's not that big of a deal, it is not some kind of struggle to walk with everybody else. So I guess this phrase works more with hostesses about dealing with being denied rather than Keima actually sacrificing and struggling with something.
Also some people say that walking like everybody else meant not manipulating people. But Keima doesn't have any reason to do at the end anyway. The only reasons he had to do it was to save himself from getting beheaded and to save everyone else. Otherwise he wouldn't bother to do it.
This parts don't make sense to me at all.

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u/Finikyu Sep 17 '26 edited Sep 17 '26

The narrative does a poor job of excusing Keima for his manipulations, he is forced to and when he doesn't have to he stops, but the problems come into play that he's just being more honest about it at the end. He doesn't actually offer anyone friendship, closure, or anything.
He thinks by separating and not disclosing and just moving on he's "setting them free" because he isn't trying to play the game anymore but it's an immature way to deal with the situation.
He doesn't actually take responsibility, even if forced into the situation with of course Tenri being the biggest victim of it all.
He is open about having her do a job for 10 years, but she agrees in a time of crisis, entirely for him, ignorant to the job and not knowing the level of change it will bring. He permanently changed her life at an age where she can't truly understand the magnitude of the request, but because he's asking rather than manipulating the series considers that okay and character growth. It would be fine as a "this needs to happen and he'll make up for it later" thing but he never makes up for it.
Keep in mind at this point he knows Tenri has loved him for 10 years, but does it anyway knowing he'll just let her down, but thinks because he's open about it, it's okay. Doesn't check up on her, do anything to minimise the damage, or let her down gently. Just a few words in a letter and "deal with it", when he's actively accidentally encouraged these feelings.

His love of Chihiro is weak and frankly only chosen for narrative reasons because she's framed as "real" and "normal" to set her apart from the others, ignoring that she easily falls into the same manipulations in the goddess arc, tropes and generally spits in the idea that the other girls are also real. Keima treated the others as if they're typical, tropey and routes rather than people and never actually leaves that mindset by the end, at least in an important way. He doesn't develop outside of his bad mindset, just picked the one girl he thought wasn't that, rather than...you know, actually reckoning with the fact that he used their traits against them, and recognising that despite having some standard characteristics they're just as real.
Once again, Tenri is the biggest victim of this, despite seeing first hand her real efforts he never actually engages with her once he's done with her. Never says thank you afterwards, or even acts as a real friend to her. This is true for all of the hosts, despite what he says in his letter and thinking of them as his friends.
Friends don't ditch each other after moments of crisis with just a simple "thanks."
It just leaves a bad taste because the narrative is too insistent about the divide of reality and games and only uses Chihiro as a separator, rather than actually what it should have been, Keima's growth.

Ideally he wouldn't love Chihiro, he should see her as the perfect example of how toying and manipulating someone does actual real harm, much like "The Woman" is to Sherlock. Not romantic but an important lesson and someone that embodies said lesson. Having him love her actually cheapens it. It turns what is a legitimate problematic but effective process that creates real harm into him lying, feeling bad and then rectifying that he lied, rather than his outlook on life.

TLDR; Chihiro is picked for narrative reasons and it does a disservice to every other girl, and the series does a poor job of actually making him feel fully developed. He retains his route logic to the end when the series should have been him maturing out of that ideology.

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u/Nikaidokuro Sep 17 '26

OMG, thank you, finally someone else agrees with my points.
I would just argue that the reason he tried to use the last safe was exactly to avoid Tenri getting more hurt (at least that's how I interpret that part), but after her meddling there were no more savepoints to use so he had to make a deal with her, knowing about what she would go through for 10 years. Also we don't know what he told the hosts the night before the ending, but I guess it was something very brief.
If his dialogue with Kaori never existed - I wouldn't mind this endind that much because settling at "Walking on like everybody else" would make more sense. But he actually told Kaori that he wanted to make everyone happy. But he doesn't.

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u/Finikyu Sep 17 '26 edited Sep 17 '26

He was trying to avoid getting Tenri involved, because of the lesson that Chihiro taught him and he was reminded of when he saw her again, manipulating people leads to real pain.
The problem is that he goes back on it because of Tenri, he saw her concern, recognised his own inadequacies and decided to "trust" her rather than manipulate. However narratively this trust is not rewarded, Tenri didn't do it for the world, or herself, but him and the series ends with her heartbroken, involved when she wouldn't have been if not for him (unlike every other girl who would have gotten a Weiss regardless of his involvement), and her life permanently altered. Never having a moment of privacy, in danger way more than she ever would have been and done so because he asked her. Potentially moved next door to him for the purposes of this plan because she only moved after Tenri asked Mari about it, not Mrs Ayukawa, Tenri.
Some may argue that Diana is her reward, but narratively Diana is introduced in the story too early to be a reward, Diana herself is a massive cause of problems and Tenri has never expressed a desire for friends, really. An appreciation once she has some but otherwise sticks to herself. It's not a character desire she has.

It's just unfair and Keima's attitude in that he never even attempts anything, or says anything or shows anything makes himself liable for it. It's just another problem created by a rushed ending.
We don't know what the hosts were told but we know it wasn't a lot, all of the girls have no idea what happened the next day, wanting answers and Diana herself is certain that Tenri and Keima didn't even talk afterwards, despite that being the one single only thing Tenri has ever expressed a desire for.
It's hard to care for Keima's selfish ending because he lives a selfish life, needing to be coerced to help out at first and it's definitely not selfless ending because he isn't sacrificing anything or helping anyone but himself at the end. The sacrifice is on really on Tenri, Nikaidou and to a lesser extent the other hosts.

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u/Nikaidokuro Sep 17 '26

Well, we always knew about Keima being selfish and Tenri's fate was inevitable since her sacrifice was essential for the successful timeline to exist. While I'm very sad about Tenri, if Wakaki-sensei didn't write that "I want to make everyone happy, I must get to this ending" part, I wouldn't be as mad, because Keima wanting just "walking on" would be consistent. But that part and the whole thing about Defying our fate (Either by Nikaido telling Lune that they can actually can go against the flow and don't do demon stuff or the Romeo and Juliet play where they again defied their fate) was so misleading. The whole point of the arc was that Keima getting to an established ending with the sphere and Nikaido pointing him to what he should do. There wasn't much defying, Shiratori granddad said that they did almost nothing, right events mostly happened themselves. If anything, fate was very cooperative.

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u/Finikyu Sep 17 '26 edited Sep 17 '26

Her sacrifice didn't need to be inevitable.
Could have easily written her as the final girl, not a "I have always loved you" kinda rubbish with Chihiro where we have to take his random blushes into effect and assume his moment of genuine regret was out of love and not empathy but kept Chihiro as the girl he learned from, and actually used that lesson with Tenri, where he'll actually try to get to know her as a person, for the first time really. Actually learning to appreciate people he had always written off, with Tenri being constantly dismissed, as someone worth knowing now he knows he's constantly underestimated her. If nothing else it would have made her efforts be more rewarding rather than effectively having used her, with her permission that she couldn't realistically grant because she was so young and ignorant of what it actually entailed. Total copium on my part.

Yeah the "fate" he is referring to is basically just the original timeline where the devils win, and it's just underwhelming. :/

And yeah Keima deciding to not be with anyone, being open about what happened and accepting the repercussions for his duplicity would have been far more preferable, especially as a sacrifice play where he wants to make everyone happy, aka squaring up and undoing any damage he did to the best of his ability. Ghosting people doesn't give closure. Apologising, answering questions so they know why he did what he did rather than a vague idea and just accepting their feelings towards him regardless is more mature.