"But in the UK..." I DON'T FUCKING CARE. I DON'T CARE WHAT UK CULTURE SAYS ABOUT LETTING CATS OUTSIDE!! OUTDOOR CATS BEING NORMALIZED IN THE UK DOESN'T AT ALL CHANGE THE PROBLEMS THAT COME WITH LETTING CATS OUTSIDE.

Like wtf is this argument. Yeah okay, it's acceptable to let your cats outside in the UK, encouraged even. But what does that have to do whatsoever with the discussion of if it's okay to let cats outside? No one brings up how homosexuality is penalized in some countries in conversations about LGBTQ+ rights. The fact of the matter is: culture and tradition doesn't fucking matter when it's problematic, and it isn't an excuse to put your pet and wildlife in danger.

Also, if that last comment about shelters in the UK not letting you adopt cats unless they're outdoors is true, that does not convince me to accept outdoor cat culture. All that does is convince me that those shelters are fucking stupid.

My end goal is to be able to bring my cat on hikes on a leash. I live in Colorado and that’s a big hobby of mine and I just got my kitten. He’s five months now and we have practiced walking on the leash and he’s not very good at it. I don’t practice with him daily maybe I should be. But he doesn’t understand the gentle pull means walk with me. He just walks wherever he wants to go. He’s also quite afraid of loud noises but again he is just a kitten so maybe he’ll kind of grow out of that. He is very curious and explorative. I already have a harness for him and we’ve tried it on ever since I first got him and it’s still too big for him, but I do put it on him and he’s gotten a lot better at letting me put it on him.

Do you guys have any tips on how to get a cat to walk on leash or things like that?

Fuck you stupid selfish fake bird lover.

This all started because I left a comment on a bird rehabbing page. The page had posted a video of a bird making a miraculous recovering after surviving a brutal damage from outdoor cats. I commented that people need to stop leaving their cats outdoors so cases like this don't happen again.

Suddenly I get a comment from a so called bird lover claiming I was spreading propaganda and outdoor cats are just a part of "nature taking its course" and "birds kill each other too." Oh and that I was moralizing. I never said cats were evil, I only held the owners accountable in my original comment.

I confronted them told them they were an enemy to birds and should be ashamed of themselves and how dare they call themselves a bird lover when they advocate for outdoor cats.

And they argued that they feed the birds in their area so they're not a threat to birds. YEAH RIGHT. Because advocating for the invasive species dwindling their numbers is SOOOO loving.

I blocked them after telling them they had no real arguments and that I hated people like them. What a fucking infuriating conversation. FUCK YOU, fake bird lover. How the hell can you be pro outdoor cat when you're replying to me on a video about a bird who almost DIED from being attacked by outdoor cats?!!?!?!?!

This bullshit is so ridiculous.

First let's address the most important thing: coyotes aren't only out at night. It's not unusual to see them during the day as well. Not to mention, this user says the cat comes back at 10PM.​ That's well within coyotes' normal active period. They are actively putting the cat in danger of coyotes attacking them by letting them outside.​ And they said they saw the cat around foxes? Yeah, that's not very safe either. Sure, foxes don't usually actively hunt cats like coyotes, but they're still wild animals that are bigger and stronger than the cat.

That aside, I'm also very tired of the "but my cat can't be indoors!" excuse. I don't want to assume people's situation because every animal is different, but I'm positive there's a safe solution for the cat. What about a catio? More perches? Have you tried all toys? Birdfeeders they can watch? Again, I don't know this person so I won't assume what they have and haven't tried but this is just not acceptable regardless of the circumstances.

And I think it's ridiculous that OP gave up on leashed walks. OP said it started like that, but they then the cat didn't like it because it wanted to be out all day. I'm sorry but...too bad? Going outside isn't what's best for the cat, especially in COYOTE COUNTRY. Not to mention that it isn't fair to native wildlife that almost certainly gets killed by the cat. Leashed walks are a good compromise, you can't just give pets whatever they want because they want it. And don't encourage bad behavior by letting the cat out when it yowls. Putting an invasive species outside just because it's understimulated is uncool.

Oh, and I just saw a video of the cat chasing a chipmunk. ​So we can confirm that they don't care about other animals.

Why do people fight against common sense measures?

I’m hoping someone here has dealt with this successfully because we are running out of ideas.

We live in a condo community in Florida, and one resident continually feeds stray/feral cats around the property. Feeding them violates our condo rules, and she knows that. She simply does not care.

We now have multiple feral cats roaming the property and parking lots. Some of them look sickly and unhealthy. They congregate around the property, wander between cars, climb on residents’ vehicles, and have become a significant nuisance.

The association has tried enforcing the rules against the woman feeding them. Violations and fines do not deter her. We even installed trail cameras to document the feeding. She complained to the board about the cameras and then started avoiding them, so she apparently just changes where or how she feeds the cats.

Animal control has also been contacted and has essentially told us they will not do anything.

At this point, what actually works?

Has anyone successfully dealt with a persistent feeder who refuses to stop despite HOA/condo enforcement? Are there organizations in Florida that will trap and remove or TNR a colony when animal control won’t intervene? Are there effective humane deterrents we can use on common property? Is there another government agency or resource we should contact?

To be clear, nobody wants to hurt the cats. I actually think the current situation is cruel to them too. Some appear unhealthy, they are living in parking lots and around cars, and continuing to provide food without addressing sterilization, veterinary care, or population control seems like it will just perpetuate the problem.

I’d especially appreciate advice from anyone who has actually gotten a situation like this under control.

I have nothing but respect for people having a creature to take care of that’s good for their mental health but I’ll never understand why such a large portion of society is okay with their free roaming. It’s so nasty and obviously infuriating; it doesn’t bury its shit. When I go out to garden or do lawn work I smell it before I see it. If I catch it in action I’ll run out and throw water on it but it doesn’t stop it from coming back the next day. I don’t allow my dog to free roam onto other people’s properties and I’ll never understand why it’s okay that cats can just roam and shit whenever they want, even inside of fenced in properties. Talking to the neighbors about it just gets me a “hehe sorry. Can’t control where the cat goes.” I keep scooping it up with a hand shovel and chucking it as hard as I can against their shed lol.

(No Reddit I don’t have the means for an automatic sprinkler system. Sprays and citrus have proved to be useless and a waste of money)

Just shouting into the void. Thanks for listening to me bitch.

I am not trying to say that cats deserve the horrible things that happen to them when let outside. I grew up with relatives who kept outdoor cats and the casualness that they displayed when their poor cats died due to outside causes put me off from outdoor cats completely. So I do get it.

But.. As a bird person and general nature lover, it feels like most people's argument for/belief why cats should not be outdoors is always focused on the cat's safety and no one else's. Nobody ever brings up the poor baby birds who lose their mothers and fathers bc Mittens was outside and bored. Nobody wants to say how sad it is that rn, little mice are being attacked and then delivered half chewed up to humans. Nobody ever considers the poor little lizards, frozen in terror, half injured and holding onto fading hope that maybe the cat currently batting them around after slashing them will miraculously go away so they can scurry off to attempt recovery.

It just feels wrong and unfair.

The judge doesn't seem to be taking any more BS from them. Decision is so great....

Here are some highlights:

1) But the Court cannot conclude that, without temporary relief, the removal efforts that the NPS and the Animal and Plant Health Inspection Service of the Department of Agriculture (“APHIS”) plan to “start[]” sometime in July, Dkt. 86-1 at 3, 5 (Palfrey Decl. ¶¶ 9, 12), are likely to cause irreparable harm to some of Plaintiffs’ members’ interests in observing or enjoying free-ranging cats. This is particularly so, since one of the central tenets of Plaintiffs’ arguments is that “other cats can readily access the Paseo, and no doubt will increasingly do so as fewer of the cats that have historically occupied that area remain,” Dkt. 85-1 at 12 (footnote omitted)

2) Plaintiffs do not even mention their organizational interests in their preliminary injunction motion, much less supply evidence to meet their burden of demonstrating that the Plan’s implementation during the pendency of their appeal rises to the level of an irreparable injury justifying interim relief.

3) But where, as here, the movant has failed to demonstrate a likelihood of success on the merits, or even to show that the case presents a close question for appeal

4) To start, the sliding scale does not discard the likelihood of success on the merits entirely, and where the Court has already concluded that Plaintiffs are not only unlikely to prevail but have, in fact, already lost the case

https://www.courtlistener.com/docket/68380861/alley-cat-allies-incorporated-v-united-states-national-park-service/?order_by=desc

Just sticking up PSAs about what damage feral cats do seems like a moot point to the average Joe. They'll just look at you and go "Okay. So what should we do with the cats?"

I got nothing for that.

​

I was thinking of posting lists of local TNR and cat colony groups. I disagree with TNR, but I can't think of any other alternatives.

​

I live in the US btw.

Yesterday, a federal judge ruled against Alley Cat Allies and upheld the National Park Service’s plan to remove the massive feral cat colony living at the San Juan National Historic Site in Puerto Rico (Paseo del Morro). The court agreed with NPS that the Trap-Neuter-Return (TNR) program failed because the cat population actually grew from about 120 cats to nearly 200 over the years.

The ruling says the cats are considered an invasive, non-native species harming wildlife and park resources, and NPS has legal authority to remove them.

Great ruling, but does anyone know if this means the cats can now be removed from other federal parks, etc.?

ALLEY CAT ALLIES INCORPORATED v. UNITED STATES NATIONAL PARK SERVICE, et al., Case 1:24-cv-00876-RDM; DC District Court

More shit that I've come to vent about, I think this is my 4th or 5th post here. Do I even need to explain the idiocy of these? I think this time I'll let them speak for themselves. I just need to talk to some like-minded individuals about this garbage lmao.

I'm so sick of outdoor cats. Fuck people who let them outside. I have two that won't stop visiting my house right now and I highly suspect they're the reason I'm not seeing frogs outside anymore.

I've seen this stated before by outside cat supporters. That interacting with "bodega cats", "community cats", and colonies keeps cats from becoming too aloof.

Is it BS or not?

Y'all, there have been, like, 2 arguably successful TNR schemes in the world... and both of those programs focused on A. spaying only (because neutering is just a waste of time when it comes to population control at this level), and B. Educating folks about not leaving food out...

I really am so tired of advances in "science" like this. I mean, cool, but we all know it's not gonna work.

Fucking stupid comment I saw. This is like my third post on this sub but idc, I have nowhere else to vent and I hate these people sm.

They're smug ass says "food chain", no it's fucking not. It's an invasive species. Should we be saying that about the invasive lamprey in rivers? "Ohhhhh nooo leave them alone I know they're destroying the ecosystem but but but food chain!" I hate this excuse, it's so ignorant to ecology and wildlife, and let's not forget the fact that native predators kill to eat, cats kill for fun.

Also no, they don't need to be outside to be happy. How many times do veterinarians need to debunk this for these morons to listen? Not even high energy cats like Bengals need to be outside, just play with your cat you lazy fuck. That's why they have feather toys, so they can feel like they're killing birds without actually doing it.

I find it really ironic that many shelters give cats to people who'll make them outdoor/indoor-outdoor. Like they see how these cats end up almost every day, why the fuck would they do that?! Maybe it's a capacity issue and they want to adopt out as many cats as possible so they have room for other cats, but why do they risk the cat's life again? They sometimes spend thousands of euros on a single cat, yet they'll toss it outside again. Two weeks ago I found a cat that was hit by a train. It was quite far from the rails and its body was intact, just its rear legs were hurt. It definitely suffered for minutes, maybe even hours. Do they think that this is better than putting down the cat in a vet's office? If so, how am I the heartless one? Obviously another problem is that the one cat that was saved will cause suffering of thousands native animals through its lifetime, not because it's hungry but just for its entertainment. It will break the prey's limbs and watch it suffer. They often walk away and let it suffer. But that's a completely different topic for a different post.

(Not brigading, names are blocked out. Also, this post is regarding the comments, not whether or not the opinion is correct.)

How can anyone be this dumb? Like do I even need to explain it? Veterinarians widely agree that cats can live a complete and happy life indoors, assuming their owners aren't lazy fucks that don't want to play with their own animals. These comments are being upvoted for talking out of their ass saying that indoor cat owners are prison wardens and animal abusers under no logical basis.

Can we just acknowledge the irony of insinuating that indoor cat owners are animal abusers while admitting to allowing your cat to be at the mercy of cars, predators and angry neighbors? Not to mention the damage to the animals in the ecosystem, but I guess it's not like these chucklefucks would care anyway. Ah, and upon a second check, I'm seeing some "dogs are worse" comments. How intelligent, insinuating that people who oppose outdoor cats wouldn't also oppose outdoor dogs.🙄🙄

We really need to implement the policies Australia has on outdoor cats, and that pains me to say because I love cats and I hate the idea of killing them. But it's gone too far. Ferals aren't thriving and are suffering, ecosystems are destroyed, and diseases are spread, these cats have to go. And all of it could be avoided if people could keep their damn pets indoors...