r/Scotland • u/PositiveLibrary7032 • Aug 07 '24
YouTube Journalist Explains Why Riots Are Not Occurring in Scotland and Wales.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LGDGmaYcvug132
u/Jack_Spears Aug 08 '24
"There are extremist groups, like Rangers fans or whatever."
i fuckin lost it when he said that đ
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u/Colv758 Aug 08 '24 edited Aug 08 '24
Tbf football hooliganism is really the only âmob type behaviourâ that happens within Scotland that he could highlight - itâs a long long way away from being anything like whatâs happening down south and thatâs why âRangers fans or whateverâ was said so dismissively - because the levels of destruction, battery and looting are not evenly remotely the same - the only tenuous link that draws it into the same conversation as the riots in England is that they both have people wearing the UK flag, thatâs literally the only âcommonalityâ
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u/twistedLucidity Aug 08 '24
Tbf football hooliganism is really the only âmob type behaviourâ that happens within Scotland that he could highlight
Orange Order?
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u/Colv758 Aug 08 '24 edited Aug 08 '24
Iâll never defend sectarianism shite - but the mob type behaviour with OO marches, same as with âRangers fans or whateverâ leading the Journalist to mention them in the OP video, still doesnât result in the out and out destruction weâre witnessing in England - again though the common factor with OO marches and the riots in England is also the UK flag
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u/mata_dan Aug 08 '24
Unless you count eating all the pies in an entire city and the secondary fallout from that.
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u/Jack_Spears Aug 08 '24
Aye your absolutely right, it just gave me a good wee chuckle amidst an otherwise serious subject and came seemingly out of nowhere haha.
Like, as much disdain as i have for Rangers fans in an âall banterâ kinda way, he didnt have to do them like that đ
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u/DINNERTIME_CUNT Aug 08 '24
You donât think a centuries-long link with imperialism is a commonality?
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u/Colv758 Aug 08 '24
The only link is the UK flag, not the imperialism
I wouldnât even say the English Nationalism the journalist talks about in OP video is even linked to imperialism
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u/Double_Ad3612 Aug 08 '24
George Square enters the chat...
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u/Colv758 Aug 08 '24
Sorry but not even close - even the worst Rangers or Celtic âcelebrationsâ havenât come close to whatâs happening doon the road Not even September 19th 2014 was anywhere even close to the out n out destruction and violence on display several times in the last week doon south
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u/kuntucky_fried_child Aug 08 '24
Can we also point out that loyalists annually celebrate a hate fest toward catholics in Northern Ireland. Itâs not much of a leap shift that toward hating brown people as well. Theyâre already conditioned for hate and discrimination.
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u/Red_Brummy Aug 08 '24
I am not sure this is a topic Scotland should be boasting about, as there are plenty of incidents of hate marches happening every summer across Glasgow and the surrounds.
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u/Colv758 Aug 08 '24
Hate marches in Scotland donât involve stopping cars to check the skin colour of the occupants, or smashing windscreens, flipping cars, setting them on fire, mobs of people attacking one person, smashing windows and looting shops, absolutely tearing through buildingsâŚ
thatâs the point the Journalist is making in the OP video - whatâs happening in England simply doesnât happen in Scotland and he explains why
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u/ImperitorEst Aug 08 '24
Yeah, our hate is for other white people, not minorities thanks very much đ
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u/noncebasher54 Aug 08 '24
Av no got the time tae hate broon folk... am too busy goin roond the corner tae batter the pricks that dare live on a different street tae me.
Them an raith fans. Cunts.
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Aug 08 '24
I'm no gonna stick up for the annual Orc Pride marches, they're a shower of cunts and the bands have a tendency to play the Billy Boys, the Famine Song, etc. if they think they can get away with it, but it's just not comparable. I've never seen the currant buns try to burn a building full of brown people alive.
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u/Red_Brummy Aug 08 '24
I'm no gonna stick up for the annual Orc Pride marches, they're a shower of cunts and the bands have a tendency to play the Billy Boys, the Famine Song, etc.
Excellent. Glad you agree.
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Aug 08 '24
If you wanna try and clip someone's quote, it's best if it's not directly above what you've said.
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Aug 08 '24
Even more now wirh the pro gaza marches and the anti Jewish chants.
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u/SparrowPenguin Aug 08 '24
In England there is more ethnic diversity, so it's easier to point and say "this, this is the reason why the cost of living crisis/housing crisis/bad working conditions/etc is happening. These are people I don't personally like, and feel like I'm in direct competition with".
Capitalist exploitation is less tangible and harder to beat up on the street.
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u/meshan Aug 08 '24
The impact of migration is tiny in Scotland compared to parts of England.
I live in the midlands, I was born in Airdrie. When my mixed race girlfriend and I go home to visit family, even she comments she sticks out in Airdrie. Especially for someone who lived in London for 10 years.
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u/macdara233 Aug 08 '24
Anyone who isnât possibly the missing link between man and ape sticks out in Airdrie
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u/Chaeballs Aug 08 '24
This isnât true anymore. Besides, some of the places in England where rioting was happening are like 96% white.
Glasgow is now over 19% non-white as of the 2022 census. Perhaps more now. Thatâs quite a significant amount of change. Same figure was about 5% in 2001
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u/meshan Aug 08 '24
Two points which are important.
You said significant change. I think this is part of the problem. People fear change, especially when it changes the world around them.
I was born 76. I can remember when we got our first corner shop, one day the first Indian kids joined my primary school. I can still remember the day.
Significant change is the key issue. I also remember before Muslims it was Romanians, before that Poles, before that Bangladeshi, Indians, Jamaicans, Irish, Northern, southern, catholics.
Second point, my GF and mother to my daughter. Whenever we go to the big Tesco in Airdrie, she finds it funny she's the only black person she sees.
She also finds it funny there are separate schools for catholics and protestants. I'm looking at you Sykeside.
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u/DJ_House_Red Aug 08 '24
It's because the Russians are just resetting the same resources they used to promote brexit to race riot mode
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u/eltoi Aug 08 '24
There's a lot of idiots wilfully forgetting there was rioting in Dublin last year
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u/mata_dan Aug 08 '24
And multiple times this year? Though it looked more like people going outside to see what the commotion was and then hanging around.
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u/Tapps74 Aug 08 '24
A short answer, itâs attractive to all to turn to blame when life is shitty. In England the minorities become the easy target, in Scotland we have England & Westminster.
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u/deevo82 Aug 08 '24
That's an incredibly disingenuous post.
Westminster is an administrative branch that can be elected and as part of a democratic process is open to multiple layers of scrutiny and criticism. There is even an area set aside for protests to take place.
Minorities are just human beings trying to get through life and are not accountable to a bunch of knuckle dragging thugs.
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u/Tapps74 Aug 08 '24
Not disingenuous, incredibly or otherwise. Iâm not comparing the merits of either.
The far right feeds on hate and disenchantment. Historically it has picked minorities for their followers to target and blame.
In Scotland we sometimes feel like a minority in the UK ourselves. Any need for blame we may have can be aimed at the UK Government.
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Aug 08 '24
I wouldn't be so sure, apparently Paisley is getting one of these "protests" as there's a hotel that houses asylum seekers there and people intend to protest it.
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u/Uh-huhSure Aug 08 '24
When we had the G8 at Gleneagles, English journalists described climate protestors taking over Bannockburn, with a photo of 6 neds skipping school to throw bricks at a police car.
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u/ZealousidealWorth622 Aug 10 '24
Thereâs a reason why there national footy team gets hated on so much.
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u/TehNext Aug 08 '24
More fuel to tar nationalism with a shitty brush.
This journalist/presenter has it only half right. There's plenty of English nationalists who aren't extreme. Listening to this twats narrative you'd think they're all hooligans.
Incredibly imbalanced.
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Aug 07 '24
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u/Synthia_of_Kaztropol Aug 08 '24
AFD, Donald Trump, Meloni, Marine Le Pen, Orban
all of these have received support from the russian political warfare projects - the internet troll farms, social media bots, etc.
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u/vaivai22 Aug 07 '24
The big flaw in your comment is that Unionism is on both sides of the spectrum and if they were as inherently aligned as you try to suggest, it wouldnât be confined to only England and N. Ireland at this point in time.
Frankly it looks like you just donât like unionists and tried to dress it up as something intellectual.
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u/Electronic-Nebula951 Aug 07 '24
You donât have to be nice about it. Just tell him his whole comment is shite.
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u/catsaregreat78 Aug 07 '24
It certainly makes a few non intellectual leaps. I donât think Unionists are right wingers. Some might be; in fact thatâs a statistical certainty but one does not follow the other. I imagine thereâs some hefty right wingedness in independence camps vis a vis âpurityâ nonsenseâŚ.
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u/Bassmekanik Aug 08 '24
You (rightly) point out the leaps he takes in his comment then proceed to do exactly the same.
You guys are fucking weird.
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u/TheFlyingScotsman60 Aug 08 '24
.....and this here is why there are few, if any, riots in Scotland.
You will get told, quite quickly, that you're talking shite and action will be taken to stop such drivel being spread about. If that doesn't stop you then then action, quite often collective, will be taken to physically stop you.
A la Glasgow airport incident a few years back.
We can very quickly determine that you are talking absolute shite and are a cunt and that we need to take action to stop you.
We are, personally, more protective of the general population than England are.
The Euros showed that.
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u/Moist_Farmer3548 Aug 08 '24
I think what's missing in the argument is a differentiation between people who are in favour of the union, in that sense if the unionist word, versus the type of unionists who go on marches, or support the DUP. They're not the same group, but they share a title. Possibly in the same way that small c conservatives are differentiated from big C conservatives.
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Aug 07 '24
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u/vaivai22 Aug 07 '24
You are, of course, entitled to your opinion, but all reasonable indicators point to your reasons being far from intellectual.
Basically, your argument boils down to âbecause I said soâ. You seem to hope that if you throw enough bad names in accusation, it will become true.
But your argument doesnât really stand up to the fact you never really define what a Unionist is. If you use the broadest term, youâre talking about a majority of people in all four nations- which certainly doesnât answer why itâs happening in some places and not others.
Even narrowing it down leads to trouble, as there would still be sizeable populations in all four places that would indicate something should be happening where it isnât.
Which tends to lead to the conclusion that you donât actually have anything to back up what you say, aside from the fact you donât like âunionistsâ.
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Aug 07 '24
I voted no, i voted stay. I hate these rioting pricks, my wife is the same.
2 examples straight away of how your argument is tosh.
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Aug 07 '24
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Aug 07 '24
Political faction? You are over simplifying things to huge degree here.
I'm willing to bet that a lot of English folk who engage in the riots would probably vote for Scotland leaving the UK. Would that make them part of the same faction as yourself?
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u/Vikingstein Aug 07 '24
I'd say that unionism inherently is a form of British nationalism, either a large part of it or a smaller part for some people but essentially that's what it is. In 2014, there were more reasons to vote no, nowadays there really isn't. The majority of the arguments against independence have happened anyway, and the economy is not getting better in the UK, and neither of the only two parties who will win will change that.
Effectively at this point if you're still a unionist it's likely you are a British nationalist, you might not be a big one but it's a part of you. The rioters in England are also British nationalists, they likely have a fair amount of cognitive dissonance on Scotland since they would likely to vote to kick it out the UK, but at the same time that'd break up the UK that they want to protect so keenly.
There's also the big element of the Scottish right wing and far right being hard unionists too, so it is really the team you're on. I'm not saying you have to vote for independence or support it, but be cognisant of the fact that many on the unionism side are and maybe reflect on that aspect if you see yourself as a centrist or left wing. I'll guess centrist though and that probably means I'm arguing with a brick wall since often centrists side with the right wing.
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Aug 07 '24
Coming from a indy supporter the person above is cleary not an exception. It's unfortunate imo but Scotland is slightly more unionist than independence supporting, and most of them aren't right-wing nutjobs.
I do think unionism has a more vocal group of extremists who identify with loyalists in NI and probably the racists rioting and vote tory more than Labour, but they're hardly a majority. Their ones are louder than our nutcases who get off to pan-celticism, but the vast majority of unionists aren't extreme, just like the majority of Scottish Nationalists aren't.
The GE results were
Labour 35%
SNP 30%
LD 9.7%
Tory 12.7%
Reform 7%
Green 3.8%
Alba 0.5%
Independent 0.4%
Scottish Family Party 0.2%
Trade Unionist and Socialist Coalition 0.1%
Socialist Labour Party 788 votes
Communist Party of Britain 516 votes
Liberal Party 481 votes
Social Democratic Party 415 votes
UK independence Party 313 votes
Heritage Party 230 votes
Others 4k votes
it's pretty clear the majority on both sides havent bought into this pish
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Aug 07 '24
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Aug 08 '24
Yes but that wasn't what you were saying. You were saying the non right wing unionist nutters are the exception when it's the other way around. But yes if you split as Independence v Unionism the unionists have way more right wing racists
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u/Thenedslittlegirl Aug 08 '24
Not everyone who doesnât want independence is a âunionistâ or part of a political faction. I voted yes in the referendum, Iâd likely vote no if there is a next time. Itâs not because I have any love for the union, or see my identity tied to it. Iâm Scottish first. I just think it would be a shitshow and donât think we can take any more economic upheaval.
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u/NoRecipe3350 Aug 08 '24
At least 50% of Scotland is 'Unionist', probs more since the SNP imploded. You get people of all walks of life in this bracket
Not to mention there are in fact Scottish nationalist ethno nationalists, you just don't hears/see them much because they are quite small, just like unionist ethno nationalist are also small in number (it crosses the divide)
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u/Cairnerebor Aug 08 '24
There are absolutely blood and soil nationalists.
And quite extreme.
Thankfully thereâs about 30 of them and only about 6 ever rock up to protest or hold flags over bridges.
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Aug 08 '24
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u/owls_with_towels Aug 08 '24
Sunderland is 96% white. Why did their experience of immigration lead to a riot?
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u/peakedtooearly Aug 08 '24
Have there actually been any of these riots in London or Slough?
I take your point and I think lack of integration has played a part but it's not a simple a the percentage of immigration in each nation. England and NI have a far right problem.
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u/roll_and_fritter Aug 08 '24 edited Aug 08 '24
This isn't even a percentage of immigration! It's a percentage of people's ethnicity
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Aug 08 '24 edited Aug 08 '24
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Aug 08 '24 edited Aug 08 '24
Catholic and non denominational schools exist here in Canada too, even in highly diverse cities like Toronto. âDivisionâ is absolutely not the reason they exist.
Edit: argue with it donât just downvote it ya daft cunt.
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u/Moist_Farmer3548 Aug 08 '24 edited Aug 08 '24
Where do you get the figures for terrorist attacks? Global terrorism database is showing a lot more happening in NI, but their criteria are very broad.
You also need to look at how many attacks were thwarted, which I believe is heavily tipped to the far right.
ETA: my mistake, the thwarted attacks are heavily favoured towards Islamic plots, but the growth has been massively towards the far right.
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Aug 08 '24 edited Aug 08 '24
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u/r0w33 Aug 08 '24
Link to the source for MI5 figures? Seems surprising that they'd separately list white people who can be muslim or far right and muslims who can be white or from other ethnic backgrounds...
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u/Chaeballs Aug 08 '24
Glasgow is now over 19% non-white as of the 2022 census. Perhaps closer to 20% now. Same figure was about 5% back in 2001. Thatâs still fairly significant. And of course thereâs mostly white immigration from other places in Europe too
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u/chuill Aug 08 '24
Ah, I've contributed to that. I've spawned two 'non-white' children in the years since 2001.
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u/roll_and_fritter Aug 08 '24
*noting that stating peoples race is not equivalent to number of migrants.
Conflating the two demonstrates the problem quite well
And then conflating race to terrorist attacks. So the 16 Islamic attacks weren't committed by any Brits?
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u/DoubleOhEffinBollox Aug 08 '24
What IRA attack was in Scotland? I read that they didnât carry out any attacks in Scotland and Wales because they were seen as Celtic countries, so they concentrated on England instead.
https://www.pressreader.com/uk/the-herald-on-sunday/20191013/281805695689722
Of course, if Iâm wrong, Iâm open to correction. And this isnât showing any support for them, Iâm just curious.
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u/Equal_Judge_7336 Aug 08 '24
they tried to assasinate the queen during the opening of a fuel depot in northern scotland and did destroy a bbc transmission tower around the same time period.
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u/EvilInky Aug 08 '24
The IRA attempted a bomb attack on Sullom Voe oil terminal during a visit by the Queen in 1981.
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u/Scarred_fish Aug 08 '24 edited May 08 '25
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u/Comrade-Hayley Aug 09 '24
There's just not enough fascists in Scotland to establish a riot that wouldn't get immediately shut down by anti fascists and the polis
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u/mata_dan Aug 08 '24
Fact is the media and political machine aren't as good at or as focussed on dividing us as they are the bulk of folk in England, N.I. gets caught up in that due to similar wider opinions from the side where the dividing wedge is being driven.
End of (start of actually, but nobody wants the actual conversation because it's the same one we've always been having and made negative progress on).
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u/Cannaewulnaewidnae Aug 07 '24
RemindMe! 1 month
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u/docowen Aug 07 '24
Are you setting a reminder so you can gloat in the hope that there are riots in Scotland?
Because that seems like something a cunt would do.
"I hope there are riots in Scotland so I can win a pointless argument on the internet."
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u/RemindMeBot Aug 07 '24 edited Aug 08 '24
I will be messaging you in 1 month on 2024-09-07 23:11:28 UTC to remind you of this link
1 OTHERS CLICKED THIS LINK to send a PM to also be reminded and to reduce spam.
Parent commenter can delete this message to hide from others.
Info Custom Your Reminders Feedback -23
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u/TokerFraeYoker Aug 08 '24
The main concern for anyone whoâs got Irish blood should be that we seen republican and northern Irish flags flown side by side. My father said that would never happen in his lifetime or mine.
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u/Thenedslittlegirl Aug 08 '24
Iâd happily see those flags flown side by side in different circumstances (eg not knuckle draggers temporarily brought together by racism). Both sides of the political divide in NI living harmoniously should be the goal for anyone not driven by the desire to claim an identity that isnât even theirs because they have romantic ideas about their âIrish bloodâ.
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Aug 08 '24
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u/Chaeballs Aug 08 '24
But in Glasgow about a fifth of the population is non-white as of the 2022 census. Thatâs significantly more than some of the places where rioting was taking place in England
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u/mrchhese Aug 08 '24
One thing not mentioned much on this comparison is the general lack of riots in Scotland full stop. When was the last riot in Scotland? Even the poll tax riots were worse in England than Scotland.
Whether racism is better here is debatable but its expression with things like this are certainly much more small scale.
It's certainly not and English thing though despite what some here want to suggest. Not just Ireland but similar things across the continent. It's also just kindergarten compare to ethnic riots in places like India.