r/westworld • u/NicholasCajun Mr. Robot • Apr 06 '20
Discussion Westworld - 3x04 "The Mother of Exiles" - Post-Episode Discussion
Season 3 Episode 4: The Mother of Exiles
Aired: April 5, 2020
Synopsis: The truth doesn’t always set you free.
Directed by: Paul Cameron
Written by: Jordan Goldberg & Lisa Joy
Please use spoiler tags for the discussion of episode previews and any other future spoilers. Use this format: >!Westworld!< which will appear as Westworld.
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Apr 06 '20
Props to Dolores for spooning herself like the classy self-sufficient serial killer she is
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u/ImaFrakkinNinja Apr 06 '20
I’d do me.
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u/PM_SWEATY_NIPS Apr 06 '20
Especially if both versions of me were played by those actresses
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u/thegarrett Apr 06 '20
Omg if a hot actor played me I’d be like “it’s ok baby just go to sleep. I’m here...”
I mean host, oops
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Apr 06 '20
That was the exact moment I realized Charlotte Hale was just another copy of Dolores. When Dolores was talking about how well she knows her I suspected, because the only other people who Dolores knew well were Teddy and her father, the former having gone to the valley beyond and the latter having been lobotomized.
At first I thought she'd made 2 copies of Bernard, one to fight against her and one to fight on her side, but when she spooned her I realized what was happening. Still, it didn't occur to me that all the pearls were Dolores.
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u/kikimakani Apr 06 '20
The person Dolores trusts as much as herself....is herself.
Sounds about right to be honest.
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u/gh0st_n0te119 Apr 06 '20
but once she copies herself and they’re each on their own, the different versions of her will meet different people, have different experiences, different challenges, thus starting to make each version of dolores different and unique.
what if one version of her has a change of heart or starts to feel conflicted. It’s like the idea that a clone of you would still be their own person in the end
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u/CouncilmanRickPrime Apr 06 '20
They're setting us up already for the Hale version to do so. That's why her relationship with Nathan has been emphasized.
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u/abagofdicks Apr 08 '20
You’d think they’d have some synchronization software in those domes of theirs.
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Apr 06 '20
Meanwhile, William can't trust himself, not even his own experience of reality. But if/when one of the doloreses mess up, Dolores also won't be able to trust herself.
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u/chrthedarkdream Apr 07 '20
And here we have it. In the last episode, Dolores will bug out because of some weird conflicts and crash.
Doesn't matter how much processing power you have. An infinite loop is an infinite loop.
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u/Huntrrz Apr 06 '20
But she will eventually run into a situation that she can’t handle because all her compatriots share a single way of thinking. I think it is the same flaw in Serac’s plan; there’s only one path and when it encounters something outside its bounds it breaks down.
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u/TheBigLeMattSki Apr 08 '20
But she will eventually run into a situation that she can’t handle because all her compatriots share a single way of thinking.
I think she planned ahead for this situation in the form of Bernard. She's definitely done something with him to use him later as an ace in the sleeve.
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u/Luissalvadorf Apr 09 '20
So she trusted Caleb, does this means Caleb is the last Dolores? because they've only shown 4 versions of Dolores by now.
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u/Cupcakeann Apr 06 '20
That Liam and his creepy rich friend’s dialogue, was almost the exact same as William and Logan dialogue when they first arrived at West world
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u/Roserachel1111 Apr 06 '20
Yes!!! Completely ..... And the bar with serac and Maeve was like when william met Ford and he shared the personality card
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u/TheTruckWashChannel Apr 06 '20
That bar location was gorgeous, anyone know where it is?
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u/Pantzzzzless Apr 06 '20
And Liam's friend said 'who dies from an overdose anymore?'. Logan sure did.
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u/theillini19 Apr 06 '20
Damn I completely forgot Logan existed
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u/planets1633 Apr 06 '20
I say this about multiple characters every time I start reading these post-ep threads. If I were kidnapped and my captors said they wouldn’t kill me if I could just name a character - or even just one thing, anything - from each of the previous seasons of WW, I would surely be dead.
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Apr 06 '20
Don’t know the actor’s name, but I wish the man who played Ramsay Bolton in GoT had been cast for that.
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u/crablette Apr 06 '20 edited Dec 12 '24
decide pot soup snails steep slim encourage grey telephone panicky
This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact
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u/TheTruckWashChannel Apr 06 '20
Rafi Gavron. He's Lady Gaga's douchebag manager from A Star Is Born.
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Apr 06 '20
Biggest takeaway from this episode is Dolores is now also played by Hiroyuki Sanada.
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u/WR810 Apr 06 '20
I hope there's a credit (maybe in episode eight) where the Dolorii are credited as actor / main role / Dolores.
For instance Tessa Thompson / Charolette Hale / Dolores.
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u/MadIfrit Apr 06 '20 edited Feb 16 '26
This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact
chunky friendly amusing bedroom intelligent sophisticated long spark divide whistle
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Apr 06 '20 edited Apr 06 '20
In The Good Place there is an episode where D'Arcy Carden plays multiple characters that all look like her character (Janet). In the script she's referred to as Janet, Neutral Janet, Eleanor-Janet, Chidi-Janet, Jason-Janet and Tahani-Janet all in the same episode. I don't thin she's credited that way though.
There is also a scene where she is Eleanor-Janet pretending to be Jason-Janet.
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u/alarbus Apr 06 '20
The plural of Dolores would also be Dolores or Doloreses (given that Dolores is already plural of dolor, 'sorrow').
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u/matt111199 Apr 06 '20
Wait my mind is blanking—he was Hector’s double in Shogun World right?
It’s curious why he’s the only other Dolorii who keeps a host appearance if that’s true.
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u/thefifthlittlepig Apr 06 '20
Most likely Dolores was giving herself a tactical advantage against Maeve, she knew that Maeve would initially respond to Musashi based on their previous relationship. Also, Maeve would have expected to see some random Yakuza guy, not Musashi, and the momentary confusion gave Dolores an advantage, which she exploited. It would have been relatively easy for Maeve to devise a strategy against an unknown human enemy, but knowing that it was another host inside Musashi's shell meant that Maeve had to first try to figure out who it was before she could formulate the best strategy against that particular host. She would have used a different strategy against, say, Teddy, than she would have with Clementine or Angela. It slowed her down.
ShogunWorld gave Maeve some pretty handy swordfighting skills, and Musashi was a master. Dolores would have wanted to arm herself effectively against Maeve's skills, and Musashi was the best fit for that.
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u/Manderelli Apr 06 '20
So is Bernard the only other pearl Dolores used other than making several copies of her own? Is that why the Pearl's were all clean except for the one bloodied one?
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u/novacolumbia Apr 06 '20
When your thumbprint gets denied at the upscale brothel..
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Apr 06 '20
Speaking of thumb prints, why does bio authentication use blood and not thumbprint + blood? Surprised Caleb was able to transfer the money
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u/cohrt Apr 06 '20
this. they didn't have pictures of the account holders but they have their DNA?
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Apr 06 '20
were the brothel workers robots?
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u/LucretiusCarus Apr 06 '20
I think so. They showed people using tablets similar to ones in the theme park to control them.
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u/StandardDefinition Apr 06 '20
He was just trying to donate to charity, he didn't even want the woman /s
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u/wednesday____addams Apr 08 '20
Reminds me of the "orgy" scene from "Eyes Wide Shut" with Tom Cruise
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u/composedkoala Apr 06 '20
Let’s hear it for the Man in White
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u/SerDire Apr 06 '20
I can’t be the only one who feels it’s slightly dirty how they did William. Have him show up four episodes into the season only to ship him off to the mental institution
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u/XenoVX Apr 06 '20
I think he was in other scenes in the trailer a few months ago
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u/oneders Apr 06 '20
He may still have a role to play. Maybe Dolores figures out how to actually make a human / host and did it to William and then has some twisted plan for him.
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u/imariaprime Apr 06 '20
I don't understand why people think he's just out of the show now. He's going to suffer in that place, and it's going to remake him. I mean, he's got more scenes in the trailer. He just needs this arc to go from the ruined man who shot his own daughter into the Man in Black the world kind of needs.
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u/FragmentedChicken Apr 06 '20
That's part of his redemption arc, the man in white
He was probably going to kill himself if left alone in his house
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u/Dahhhkness Apr 06 '20
Goddamn, Charlotte’s and Musashi’s actors got Dolores’ mannerisms dead-on.
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u/aaronclark05 Apr 06 '20
I noticed Hale's mannerisms being very Dolores-y last week after watching it a few times. I'm glad that I'm not crazy picking up on that
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u/NightWillReign Apr 06 '20
There were hints all over the last episode with the mirror symbolisms. What confirmed it for me this episode was when Hale helped shave William like Dolores did in Season 1.
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u/trimonkeys Apr 06 '20
Yeah Hale was acting very Dolores like this episode so I thought the Dolores Wyatt theory was going to come true.
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u/treskro Apr 06 '20
She sounded exactly like Dolores when she was institutionalizing William.
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u/capndelirium Apr 06 '20
Now if only Altered Carbon had been able to nail it too.
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u/X_is_the_new_Y Apr 06 '20
Aww, I like AC. I understand the criticism of S2, but S1 rocked.
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u/dukea42 Apr 06 '20
Yup, biggest ball drop of a potential series. Netflix just didn't invest in the continuity.
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u/not_responsible Apr 06 '20
Dude, it explains why in interviews Tessa talked so much about how she had to learn how to be a host from Evan! Like obviously you could take it at face value but I like the new implications of that statement!
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u/nos4atugoddess Apr 06 '20
If it’s the same interview I saw with ERW too, they started laughing about how ERW was the on set Dolores consultant, and I thought then “did more than one person need Dolores consulting?”
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u/AJStroup22 Apr 06 '20
Looking back on it, it’s so obvious the pods would all be Dolores. She’s never trusted anyone, let alone 5 people.
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u/2rio2 Apr 06 '20
She trusted Teddy and William and look how those ended up.
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u/deltaWhiskey91L Apr 06 '20
The only host that was loyal to her was Angela but only truly under Ford's direction for the Wyatt narrative.
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u/imariaprime Apr 06 '20
She’s never trusted anyone, let alone 5 people.
I'd suspected they were all Dolores, based mostly on this point. She's never been big on allies.
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Apr 06 '20
Imagine being born and being constantly raped and murdered for most of your life. It's a miracle how sane she is, and how much restraint she has
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u/pitty_chan Apr 06 '20
"Are you willing and evil or blameless and desperately enslaved?"
Emily is fucking savage.
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u/starkandstormborn Apr 06 '20
It was such a good fucking argument he's ultimately having with himself, and I love that they brought Katja Herbers back to deliver the lines as only Emily could.
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u/pitty_chan Apr 06 '20
It's so good because it's brutal and true. No wonder William has broken, even his mind is asking him what is the real him, the Man In Black or the baby William who cared what an android thought of him.
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u/ShouldersofGiants100 Apr 06 '20
Is it his mind though? Those visions of Emily were VERY similar to that final vision of Dolores, which seemed to be a real conversation between the two and could have been the result of the injection. What if Dolores is using some kind of VR technology to mess with William? She was appearing as Emily, using data acquired from the forge. This would also explain why his 'vision' of Dolores was aware of Emily's plan—because Dolores looked up Emily while she was in the Forge and used that knowledge to screw with William.
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u/_that_clown_ Apr 06 '20
I mean Dolores, in the end, could be another hallucination as well. Like his mind trying to realize everything wrong he has done And Dolores is part of it as well.
When he asked if he's real, she didn't answer him. It could mean she doesn't know either because it's his own mind asking these questions.
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u/beanbarrage18 Apr 06 '20
I mean Dolores was spying on William and that's why she knew that William was having those weird visions of Emily. She probably saw how crazy he was turning and wanted to use that to her advantage.
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u/420BJsGamble Apr 07 '20
Don’t think so, at the end she said he should be happy that those hallucinations of his daughter were his and none of her(Delores) doing
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u/marenicolor Apr 06 '20 edited Apr 07 '20
Superb acting and what a brutal line
Edit: holy wow my first silver!!!! Thank you very much kind redditor 👍
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u/ErebosGR Apr 06 '20 edited Apr 10 '20
"Are you willing and evil or blameless and desperately enslaved?"
Which also applies to Dolores. And Caleb. Or anyone really. It's basic sophistry, not some profound philosophical argument.
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u/astalola Apr 06 '20
This is basically the question I’ve been analyzing for a semester for a uni class and it hit me like a truck when she said it
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u/pitty_chan Apr 06 '20
And its such a relevant one for William. He has wanted his agency to mean something ever since he pushed Logan against that wall, but he can't face being responsible for the deaths of his wife and daughter as well. But there is only one answer to that question.
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u/ErebosGR Apr 06 '20
It also applies to Dolores (and Caleb) or anyone really. It's basic sophistry.
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u/wittykitty7 Apr 06 '20
At first I was wondering if that version of Emily could be a real, corporeal body with one of the pearls in her noggin.
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Apr 06 '20
It's great to see Katja Herbers again. It scene perfectly encapsulated his story arc last season.
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u/Clariana Apr 06 '20
It is the dilemma underpinning Christianity, though, isn´t it?
Does man have free will or is that will subjugated by an omnipotent good?
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u/pitty_chan Apr 06 '20
I don't think it might be exclusive to Christianity. This season is making a point free will is not free because we are constricted by a system of our own making.
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Apr 06 '20
The answer is both. He feels enslaved, so he acts out in evil, its a never ending loop
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u/LeeRobbie Apr 06 '20
So, Dolores is using the Yakuza to either import or produce the host creating milk/goo.
Does this mean she has made more hosts? Has she also found a way to make more brain balls? If so, there could end up being a host army.
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u/EBone12355 Apr 06 '20
Yup. She’s using the Yakuza distillery to create host goo. We’ve got an army coming.
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Apr 06 '20
Okay I think this season is leading towards Dolores vs Dolores. Her cloning of herself may seem smart, trust no one but yourself and all that. But she's also created another individual(s) who thinks exactly like she does and know most of her plans. Except, there are a few key things. Halores clearly didn't know that Dolores had the encryption key when Serac told her. And earlier in that episode Dolores told Halores that she "owned" her. And we all know how much Dolores hates to be owned or out of control. I think Dolores made a crucial mistake by creating Halores. Halores will betray her, in part because of her awakening/feeling over Hale's son. She's suffering, becoming more aware and more independent. Dolores fucked herself over by only creating copies of herself. In her hubris, she's created her own undoing.
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u/[deleted] Apr 06 '20
I like how this season didn't drag out the "Who the Hale are they?" mystery